(;GM[1]FF[4]CA[UTF-8]
SZ[19]RU[AGA]KM[5.50]TM[]
PB[ChampFr2]PW[ChampFr2]DT[2002-08-24]PC[The Kiseido Go Server (KGS) at http://kgs.kiseido.com/]C[ChampFr2 [-\]: Hello all
fdevolder [16k\]: hi
Treky [30k?\]: bastaman!!!!!!
ChampFr2 [-\]: White is Helmstetter Bernard (4d), 3 wins
ChampFr2 [-\]: Black is Ben Malek Farid (5d), 3 wins
fdevolder [16k\]: ChampFr2, tu devrais mettre les ancien round retransmis dans tes infos, comme ton collegue
Bastaman [11k\]: hello
ChampFr2 [-\]: time : 1h15 each player, + byo-yomi 15 stones in 5'
]
;B[pd]CR[pd]
;W[dp]CR[dp]
;B[qp]CR[qp]
;W[dd]CR[dd]
;B[fq]CR[fq]
;W[cn]CR[cn]
;B[kq]CR[kq]
;W[qj]CR[qj]C[Acro [11k\]: mini-chinois?
]
;B[pk]CR[pk]C[fdevolder [16k\]: chinois en q3
]
;W[pj]CR[pj]C[Acro [11k\]: non, mini-chinois.
Acro [11k\]: r4/f3/l3 = mini-chinois
jim [6d\]: who is black
domi [1k?\]: yes Acro this is the mini chinese
domi [1k?\]: ChampFr2 [-\]: White is Helmstetter Bernard (4d), 3 wins ChampFr2 [-\]: Black is Ben Malek Farid (5d), 3 wins
Acro [11k\]: domi: I play it as Black, it's just as well I can notice it
Acro [11k\]: :)
minismurf [4d?\]: such a sad opening
minismurf [4d?\]: no ingenuity at all by black
domi [1k?\]: I never play mini chinese (too difficult for me)
]
;B[ok]CR[ok]C[domi [1k?\]: they copy the pro ?
]
;W[rl]CR[rl]
;B[qm]CR[qm]C[jim [6d\]: P10 unusual
Acro [11k\]: r14 now?
jim [6d\]: maybe black a little better now
minismurf [4d?\]: you mean Q10?
Haboru [5d\]: no r9 I think
domi [1k?\]: :-))
minismurf [4d?\]: there was no P10 yet
]
;W[qf]CR[qf]C[jim [6d\]: and black M5
jim [6d\]: only move
domi [1k?\]: often jim makes mistakes in giving coordinates^
]
;B[oj]CR[oj]C[jim [6d\]: M5 is ok
Haboru [5d\]: good thick move p10
minismurf [4d?\]: jim are you sure you are commenting on the right game?
domi [1k?\]: lol
]
;W[nc]CR[nc]C[domi [1k?\]: B13 is an overplay I think
jim [6d\]: why minismurf?
Acro [11k\]: attach to the strong stone?
Acro [11k\]: (q14?)
]
;B[pf]CR[pf]
;W[pg]CR[pg]
;B[of]CR[of]C[domi [1k?\]: bravo Acro
BigDoug [28k?\]: winner !
Acro [11k\]: r15 now, surely
Acro [11k\]: then someone strong can tell us whether r16 or p16 in response to that :)
sita [2d\]: is r17 overplay?
Acro [11k\]: I was thinking r15 as it looked like a key shape point for B...
benni [4k\]: yes, but then white is shut off from the center maybe?
sita [2d\]: w is shut of anyway. That's why I thought about r17.
PetaWilson [8k\]: hm, i would try to live as largely as possible
]
;W[qe]CR[qe]C[BigDoug [28k?\]: how about wR15, bQ15, wO15 to keep from being shut off from the centre
minismurf [4d?\]: B Q15 is out of the question :)
]
;B[qd]CR[qd]
;W[og]CR[og]C[fdevolder [16k\]: bad shape
minismurf [4d?\]: P16 is always better shape in comparison
domi [1k?\]: O16 ?
Acro [11k\]: r16 is normal here, though?
BigDoug [28k?\]: that's really good.  i didn't realise that before.  thank you
sita [2d\]: but now w escapes, so benni's comment was maybe correct.
Acro [11k\]: m17?
]
;B[nd]CR[nd]C[Acro [11k\]: might be overplay
]
;W[md]CR[md]C[domi [1k?\]: O16 for the shape
]
;B[ng]CR[ng]C[domi [1k?\]: now O13
minismurf [4d?\]: they are playing too quickly i think
domi [1k?\]: the last B moves : no other choice I think
]
;W[nh]CR[nh]C[minismurf [4d?\]: i would not be comfortable with this black shape so i would hesitate
domi [1k?\]: has someone here studied mini chinese ?
Haboru [5d\]: big temptation for B P12 now
domi [1k?\]: yes but
Haboru [5d\]: but ??
SilverKCGo [27k\]: if you put it there the stone is dead
domi [1k?\]: I don't know HABORU 
Haboru [5d\]: I think it id good
SilverKCGo [27k\]: you are right
domi [1k?\]: maybe yes this is the only move
]
;B[oc]CR[oc]
;W[ne]CR[ne]
;B[od]CR[od]C[domi [1k?\]: glups
Acro [11k\]: and I guess W can't defend all the cuts at once...
]
;W[oi]CR[oi]C[BigDoug [28k?\]: do you think this result was better than the bP12 idea?
Haboru [5d\]: Definitly I prefered P12 , but the way of B playing is safe
minismurf [4d?\]: b P12 is too hard to give any conclusions
minismurf [4d?\]: but it seemed possible
domi [1k?\]: I am sad we can't ask a strong player
]
;B[nf]CR[nf]C[domi [1k?\]: I mean as strong as a pro
minismurf [4d?\]: Haboru is strong :)
Haboru [5d\]: Question of style : on psychological point of view the 6 d must not take risk against the 2 or 3 d
]
;W[jc]CR[jc]C[domi [1k?\]: yes he is and you are too smurf
BigDoug [28k?\]: as a 28k, i think 4d and 5d are bloody strong players 8-)
domi [1k?\]: but Big here the B player is a 5/6 d european you know ?
PetaWilson [8k\]: c11?
Haboru [5d\]: No I know almost no european players
BigDoug [28k?\]: are the european ratings stronger than the kgs ratings?
Acro [11k\]: it varies
ChampFr2 [-\]: 5/6 europ = about 7/8 kgs
Acro [11k\]: kgs is stronger in the kyus it appears
Acro [11k\]: and euro in the dans
Haboru [5d\]: 5d in France = 77 on KGS
BigDoug [28k?\]: i see.  thanks
Haboru [5d\]: 5d = 7d
Acro [11k\]: and France has the strongest ratings in western Europe
Acro [11k\]: basically a stone stronger than the UK, it appears
minismurf [4d?\]: not Holland?
Haboru [5d\]: 2 stones differnce with french system
domi [1k?\]: yes and england the lower Acro ;-(
Acro [11k\]: domi: we're actively aiming to synchronise on european ratings
SilverKCGo [27k\]: what about 
Acro [11k\]: so it'll sort itself out
domi [1k?\]: maybe more than one stone Acro
domi [1k?\]: next move ?
Acro [11k\]: c11?
benni [4k\]: d11
ChampFr2 [-\]: black ?
Haboru [5d\]: F5 ?
]
;B[ko]CR[ko]C[ChampFr2 [-\]: i knew it :-)
domi [1k?\]: :-) pheno
Acro [11k\]: chfr2= pheno?!
ChampFr2 [-\]: no, it's Skal
Acro [11k\]: ah
Acro [11k\]: salut :)
]
;W[dj]CR[dj]C[minismurf [4d?\]: the strongest players teach us good positional judgement :)
domi [1k?\]: salut Skal
ChampFr2 [-\]: salut à tous
Haboru [5d\]: Gut w move , not invade
Haboru [5d\]: Do the same as black, build
Acro [11k\]: an invasion at p3's still on, isn't it?
minismurf [4d?\]: hardly
domi [1k?\]: Haboru, do you like this game ? (not messy enough for you maybe ??)^^
]
;B[hc]CR[hc]C[Haboru [5d\]: Very difficult decision for black now
minismurf [4d?\]: H17 is nice, this most i wanted before L5
minismurf [4d?\]: move
]
;W[fc]CR[fc]
;B[id]CR[id]C[Haboru [5d\]: L15
domi [1k?\]: and how to answer if W have played K15 ?
]
;W[jd]CR[jd]C[PetaWilson [8k\]: L15 better then K16?
Haboru [5d\]: No , different
]
;B[if]CR[if]
;W[je]CR[je]C[PetaWilson [8k\]: ah ok
]
;B[gf]CR[gf]C[Haboru [5d\]: But one is surely  better " in absolut " but I don't know which one
]
;W[nb]CR[nb]C[domi [1k?\]: K14
]
;B[ob]CR[ob]C[PetaWilson [8k\]: me neighter :-(
BigDoug [28k?\]: would bK14 been a more aggressive move than bP18?
domi [1k?\]: no I mean now K14
row21 [30k?\]: w k14?
Haboru [5d\]: no K14 for W can not be good
domi [1k?\]: why habo ?
row21 [30k?\]: y? 
minismurf [4d?\]: helping black
row21 [30k?\]: trap w? help in wat way?
minismurf [4d?\]: pushing from behind
domi [1k?\]: B would be happy to play K14 no ?
]
;W[kg]CR[kg]C[Haboru [5d\]: only defensive,, build nothing ( in front of 013 and 014 ) and will reinforce Black
minismurf [4d?\]: this is not pushing from behind
Haboru [5d\]: that's good shpae for same purpose
domi [1k?\]: ok keima is better so thx
ChampFr2 [-\]: black looks at pierre colmez's game
BigDoug [28k?\]: yes, thank you
PetaWilson [8k\]: and smiling?
ChampFr2 [-\]: don't know
PetaWilson [8k\]: :-)
domi [1k?\]: Black, Farid, always do that during his games
ChampFr2 [-\]: now he's back
ChampFr2 [-\]: *many* players here do that all the time
minismurf [4d?\]: smile?
domi [1k?\]: :-))
PetaWilson [8k\]: lol
minismurf [4d?\]: look at Pierre Colmez's game?
ChampFr2 [-\]: pierre and others
domi [1k?\]: I asked a question which recieve no answer : how do they feel their game be on KGS in direct live ?
ChampFr2 [-\]: no complaint for now
ChampFr2 [-\]: they don't even seem to notice the computers during play
domi [1k?\]: are they curious, excited or neutral ?
ChampFr2 [-\]: farid *is* curious :-)
domi [1k?\]: don't notice the computer pfffffff they try to adopt oriental style maybe
]
;B[df]CR[df]C[domi [1k?\]: Skal can we hope for a Pierre Colmez - Farid, later ?
ChampFr2 [-\]: i cannot say beforehand
ChampFr2 [-\]: if they play together, probably
]
;W[ln]CR[ln]C[domi [1k?\]: ok I hope ;-))
domi [1k?\]: Farid was insei in Japan during one year he has an academic style (this is not Pierre's case :-))
ChampFr2 [-\]: remaining time : B 47'  -  W 53'
domi [1k?\]: Next time Skal I think the Champ must have a 7d level to be at the top of the list
PetaWilson [8k\]: is this a reducing-move?
ChampFr2 [-\]: yes, actually we thought about 1p
domi [1k?\]: 1p is not the level of the players
ChampFr2 [-\]: yes, but that's irrelevant
domi [1k?\]: yes this is a reducing move
minismurf [4d?\]: serious about that champ?
domi [1k?\]: next move ?
minismurf [4d?\]: are you serious about giving the winner a pro rating?
ChampFr2 [-\]: why, yes! it would be a meaningless artificial rating
ChampFr2 [-\]: not the winner, just champ1 et 2
minismurf [4d?\]: heh, aha :)
ChampFr2 [-\]: so that they are at the top of the game list :-)
ChampFr2 [-\]: pheno adds: farid is already a pro dan
domi [1k?\]: W has some idea to make the push and cut at R8 interesting ?
BigDoug [28k?\]: m9?
domi [1k?\]: M9 greedy !!!!
BigDoug [28k?\]: or just the move of a really bad player 8-)
domi [1k?\]: lol
BigDoug [28k?\]: i thought you extend three spaces from a two-stone wall
minismurf [4d?\]: that is tactics
minismurf [4d?\]: strategy is something else
BigDoug [28k?\]: yes, that's true
domi [1k?\]: the question now is to keep some points in the lower area in attacking the stone
domi [1k?\]: imho :-)
domi [1k?\]: and without giving W a too esay way to stabilize and pick the 3 B stones
BigDoug [28k?\]: how about n8?
domi [1k?\]: lol
Acro [11k\]: maybe k7?
Acro [11k\]: which would make a move like f5 big
domi [1k?\]: smurf what would you play ?
]
;B[dk]CR[dk]C[minismurf [4d?\]: not this :)
domi [1k?\]: lol
domi [1k?\]: shisho breaker ?
]
;W[ej]CR[ej]C[domi [1k?\]: one says that when you don't know how to play locally, play lsewhere
domi [1k?\]: elsewhere
]
;B[dm]CR[dm]C[BigDoug [28k?\]: would wF5 be an idea worth considering?
minismurf [4d?\]: what is your followup to F5?
Treky [30k?\]: bwe4
Treky [30k?\]: errr. .B E4
Treky [30k?\]: then W E5, then B d5?
minismurf [4d?\]: that's completely impossible
minismurf [4d?\]: D3 would be after E5
minismurf [4d?\]: but this sequence completely disregards the last 2 stones that black played
Treky [30k?\]: lol!!! not if I was playin!
BigDoug [28k?\]: i would follow up with wG7 to keep the black groups separate and keep communication with the centre
]
;W[fp]CR[fp]C[minismurf [4d?\]: black is trying the idea to split off the 2 black stones
minismurf [4d?\]: but F4 gives black less choice about how to answer
]
;B[gp]CR[gp]
;W[fo]CR[fo]C[BigDoug [28k?\]: the beginner books which i'm reading say to avoid contact plays with weak stones, because the weaker stone then becomes stronger
minismurf [4d?\]: yes, that's true quite often
domi [1k?\]: W attacks the D stones here
minismurf [4d?\]: so black leans on this strong stone to attack the other white stones
]
;B[gm]CR[gm]C[BigDoug [28k?\]: obviously these players are far, far superior to me, but would wF5 directly have avoided strengthening bF3?
domi [1k?\]: F5 would have been gote
BigDoug [28k?\]: yes, that's true.  did playing wF4, then wF5 avoid that?
]
;W[gj]CR[gj]C[domi [1k?\]: the game will become messy very soon I think
minismurf [4d?\]: G3 is a nice follow-up for white now
minismurf [4d?\]: but that is also messy :)
domi [1k?\]: do you think this is the moment for G3 ?
minismurf [3d?\]: no, not really, i was just explaining what F4 and F5 does compared to F5 only
domi [1k?\]: yes very important
domi [1k?\]: arghhh goedel just arrived
Acro [11k\]: domi: the answer is a computer with multiple monitors
Acro [11k\]: so you can watch more games at once
Acro [11k\]: :)
domi [1k?\]: no no Acro sorry that was a private remark for smurf
BigDoug [28k?\]: it is almost midnight here and my wife will unplug the computer in two minutes
minismurf [3d?\]: haha Doug
BigDoug [28k?\]: thanks to all for your kind comments during this game
domi [1k?\]: bye bye doug :)
BigDoug [28k?\]: cheers.  good night everyone
]
;B[jh]CR[jh]C[domi [1k?\]: skal what about an another announcement in english room ?
ChampFr2 [-\]: I'm no longer Skal :)
domi [1k?\]: pffffff 
ChampFr2 [-\]: there is such an anounce four lines above the last one
Acro [11k\]: donc, qui etes-vous?
Acro [11k\]: :)
domi [1k?\]: oui qui es tu
ChampFr2 [-\]: i'm Skal
ChampFr2 [-\]: Jean Michel won against Antoine Roche
ChampFr2 [-\]: he has now 4 wins
domi [1k?\]: how is Bernard H here, nervous, smiling or ?
ChampFr2 [-\]: nervous, as usual
ChampFr2 [-\]: farid is very calm, as usual also
]
;W[el]CR[el]C[domi [1k?\]: hmmmm seems to be calm is mayb better :-)
ChampFr2 [-\]: guess where is black?
ChampFr2 [-\]: remaining time : B 29'   W 32'
]
;B[kk]CR[kk]
;W[lq]CR[lq]
;B[kr]CR[kr]
;W[oq]CR[oq]C[sita [2d\]: Difficult for b now. Killing? Not killing? And if not, to which battlefield switch afterwards.
ChampFr2 [-\]: black holds his head with both hands
ChampFr2 [-\]: very intensive thinking
sita [2d\]: So he thinks about killing. ;-)
ChampFr2 [-\]: white seems less nervous.
ChampFr2 [-\]: remaining time: B 15'   -   W 31'
]
;B[qq]CR[qq]C[domi [1k?\]: killing ? are you serious ?
sita [2d\]: Well, I do not want to be w and make these stones alive.
sita [2d\]: have to make
]
;W[lp]CR[lp]C[ChampFr [-\]: news : Toru beats Dinh
domi [1k?\]: ah ! a victory for Toru !!*
Codexus [18k\]: yes! Toru! :)
ChampFr [-\]: Toru has 2 wins / 5 games
flatline [18k\]: whats time on this game?
]
;B[kp]CR[kp]C[domi [1k?\]: ChampFr2 [-\]: remaining time: B 15'   -   W 31' Coup 61
ChampFr [-\]: 1h15 + 15 stones/5min
]
;W[oo]CR[oo]C[flatline [18k\]: ahh
ChampFr2 [-\]: game will speed up soon i guess
sita [2d\]: at least b's moves :)
ChampFr2 [-\]: yes :)
sita [2d\]: what is the byo?
domi [1k?\]: hmmmm sita
ChampFr2 [-\]: remaining time: B 10'     W 28'
bass [3k\]: o4?
ChampFr2 [-\]: farid looks annoyed
sita [2d\]: this was announced?... :(
domi [1k?\]: yes sita just 6 lines higher
ChampFr2 [-\]: bernard wanders around
domi [1k?\]: ;-))
sita [2d\]: indeed!
sita [2d\]: may I open my eyes now? :)
ChampFr2 [-\]: goes to p. colmez to calm down :-)
]
;B[nn]CR[nn]
;W[on]CR[on]
;B[nm]CR[nm]C[domi [1k?\]: time for R5 ?
sita [2d\]: I think, b opts for capturing m6?
domi [1k?\]: yes that would be great to cut these stone
]
;W[om]CR[om]
;B[ol]CR[ol]C[domi [1k?\]: B is going to be a hard yose in byo yomi :-(
domi [1k?\]: to have sorry
bass [3k\]: maybe b plans to kill no matter what, so there will be no yose :-)
domi [1k?\]: I would like to b able to do that in my games (I hate yose) :-p
]
;W[qo]CR[qo]
;B[ro]CR[ro]
;W[qn]CR[qn]
;B[rn]CR[rn]
;W[rm]CR[rm]
;B[ql]CR[ql]
;W[qk]CR[qk]C[Acro [11k\]: threatening to make an eye with q7...
]
;B[sm]CR[sm]C[domi [1k?\]: yes but maybe now B can cut M6
sita [2d\]: This b surley can. No way w can live in sente.
domi [1k?\]: this T7 is very surprising to me
bass [3k\]: didn't w just do so?
bass [3k\]: t7 seems very strange indeed
ChampFr2 [-\]: time : B 7'    W 15'
domi [1k?\]: B played T7 without thinking as if it was obvious
ChampFr2 [-\]: maybe he thought about it a lot before
]
;W[pl]CR[pl]
;B[pm]CR[pm]
;W[pn]CR[pn]
;B[pl]CR[pl]
;W[no]CR[no]
;B[rk]CR[rk]C[sita [2d\]: cutting of m5 isn't possible now, that's why b played s9. Seems I was wrong.
sita [2d\]: but maybe w still cannot play m5 now.
]
;W[mn]CR[mn]C[bass [3k\]: n6 will do
bass [3k\]: oh, there :-)
sita [2d\]: w thinks he can :)
domi [1k?\]: sorry sita, why cutting was not possible ?
]
;B[em]CR[em]C[sita [2d\]: m5, n6, n5, o8, n7, o10, atari
bass [3k\]: o8
bass [3k\]: duh, i'm slow
domi [1k?\]: but at this time there was no stone at O5
sita [2d\]: there was. I commented after w's o5 move
domi [1k?\]: ah sorry :-))
sita [2d\]: what if b plays o2. How can w live?
sita [2d\]: Or better: had played.
ChampFr2 [-\]: time : both 5'
]
;W[dh]CR[dh]
;B[cm]CR[cm]
;W[eq]CR[eq]
;B[gq]CR[gq]
;W[bn]CR[bn]C[sita [2d\]: It seems, b lost interest in his old target and created a now one...
]
;B[ck]CR[ck]C[sita [2d\]: new
]
;W[ef]CR[ef]
;B[eg]CR[eg]
;W[cf]CR[cf]
;B[cc]CR[cc]C[ChampFr2 [-\]: farid smiles :-)
]
;W[cd]CR[cd]
;B[dc]CR[dc]C[domi [1k?\]: ask him why please
schmorp [14k?\]: ;)
domi [1k?\]: :-)
ChampFr2 [-\]: he has a very long tongue :-)
Codexus [18k\]: lol
bass [3k\]: :-)
domi [1k?\]: he smiles but does he look happy ?
domi [1k?\]: ko in the corner ???
ChampFr2 [-\]: white (bernard) enters byo-yomi now. 15 stones in 5'
Acro [11k\]: hm
Acro [11k\]: wasn't W well ahead on time at one stage?
]
;W[ed]CR[ed]
;B[eb]CR[eb]C[sita [2d\]: yes, he used it up in the last moves
]
;W[fb]CR[fb]C[ChampFr [-\]: news : Pierre Colmez beats Nobuchi Motoki by 0.5
ChampFr [-\]: Pierre may take the lead after this round
ChampFr2 [-\]: black in b-y now
domi [1k?\]: whaouhhh
Codexus [18k\]: half-moku victories are so cool
domi [1k?\]: ko ?
]
;B[bd]CR[bd]
;W[be]CR[be]
;B[bc]CR[bc]C[domi [1k?\]: B stones are weak or light ?
noir [1k\]: please sorry for repeat perhap's
noir [1k\]: toru?
Codexus [18k\]: toru won
noir [1k\]: thanks
]
;W[jg]CR[jg]C[domi [1k?\]: arghhhh
awelux [15k?\]: light =P
awelux [15k?\]: sorry weak.
]
;B[hh]CR[hh]C[domi [1k?\]: yes weak
domi [1k?\]: J12
noir [1k\]: toru won against?
domi [1k?\]: pffffffffff
]
;W[rd]CR[rd]C[Codexus [18k\]: noir, i don't remember
]
;B[rc]CR[rc]
;W[re]CR[re]C[ChampFr2 [-\]: ivan
noir [1k\]: remets moi sur ta censor list tu seras tranquille
ChampFr [-\]: no, Toru lost to ivan
ChampFr [-\]: he won to dinh
noir [1k\]: thanks
]
;B[me]CR[me]
;W[ld]CR[ld]
;B[lb]CR[lb]C[bass [3k\]: the famous time-stealing-tesuji :-)
]
;W[mb]CR[mb]
;B[oa]CR[oa]C[domi [1k?\]: :-p
]
;W[na]CR[na]
;B[le]CR[le]C[ChampFr [-\]: Minh-Quy Nguyen (gentil) has just killed 80 stones 
]
;W[ke]CR[ke]C[sita [2d\]: I don't think s. w's shape gets some trouble.
]
;B[ib]CR[ib]
;W[jb]CR[jb]
;B[fi]CR[fi]
;W[fj]CR[fj]C[sita [2d\]: and b desperatly needed sente...
]
;B[hl]CR[hl]C[sita [2d\]: mh, seems not :)
]
;W[ij]CR[ij]
;B[ee]CR[ee]
;W[bi]CR[bi]
;B[dg]CR[dg]
;W[cg]CR[cg]
;B[de]CR[de]
;W[ce]CR[ce]
;B[ja]CR[ja]
;W[ka]CR[ka]C[bass [3k\]: m16 while it's possible?
]
;B[rg]CR[rg]
;W[qg]CR[qg]
;B[rj]CR[rj]
;W[ri]CR[ri]
;B[qi]CR[qi]
;W[pi]CR[pi]
;B[rh]CR[rh]
;W[qh]CR[qh]
;B[si]CR[si]C[domi [1k?\]: glups
Acro [11k\]: and B wins
]
;W[ig]CR[ig]C[bass [3k\]: evil..
domi [1k?\]: lol bass
]
;B[hg]CR[hg]
;W[gd]CR[gd]C[domi [1k?\]: hum W is angry now
]
;B[hi]CR[hi]C[semelis [3d\]: white can T12 and it's ko
]
;W[hj]CR[hj]
;B[ji]CR[ji]C[sita [2d\]: yes, but a ko b has nothing to lose.
sita [2d\]: and lats of internal ko threats.
sita [2d\]: lots
]
;W[he]CR[he]
;B[lh]CR[lh]C[noir [1k\]: w could connect
]
;W[li]CR[li]C[semelis [3d\]: well, white could recover some points, better than nothing
Codexus [18k\]: why didn't W play M12?
]
;B[mh]CR[mh]C[domi [1k?\]: some points ? but if dead on the right !!!!
semelis [3d\]: with what purpose ?
Codexus [18k\]: connect? I must be missing something
]
;W[sh]CR[sh]
;B[qi]CR[qi]
;W[rb]CR[rb]C[semelis [3d\]: no, after T12, T14 is sente, can make 2nd eye
]
;B[qc]CR[qc]C[Codexus [18k\]: ok thanks
]
;W[ri]CR[ri]
;B[sg]CR[sg]C[sita [2d\]: well, it's ko. I don't think, b will connect.
]
;W[mi]CR[mi]
;B[nj]CR[nj]
;W[ni]CR[ni]
;B[kh]CR[kh]
;W[sf]CR[sf]
;B[qi]CR[qi]C[deft [4d\]: T16 to make the ko lighter looks like a good move..
]
;W[lk]CR[lk]C[sita [2d\]: t16, t14, or not?
]
;B[ll]CR[ll]
;W[ri]CR[ri]
;B[pp]CR[pp]C[sita [2d\]: oh dear, endless source of threats.
deft [4d\]: T16 S14 exchange makes the ko easier to fight for W... I think B would play S11 and W S14 then W lived and B has sente would be an equal result...
]
;W[ml]CR[ml]C[ChampFr [-\]: i am gentl
deft [4d\]: hi gentil :-)
Acro [11k\]: bonjour gentil
ChampFr [-\]: hi
deft [4d\]: do you play in the championship?
ChampFr [-\]: yes, badly
ChampFr [-\]: I just kiled 80 stones :-)
deft [4d\]: that's not very nice of you ;-)
]
;B[lj]CR[lj]C[bass [3k\]: opponent's stones, i hope? :-)
deft [4d\]: I think today you're not gentil but mechant ^_^
domi [1k?\]: gentil is mechant deft
]
;W[qi]CR[qi]
;B[nl]CR[nl]
;W[nr]CR[nr]C[ChampFr [-\]: who is better ?
]
;B[pr]CR[pr]C[deft [4d\]: obvious case of split personality, domi ;-)
ChampFr [-\]: Lionel Fischer won against daniel berthelet
]
;W[lo]CR[lo]C[ChampFr [-\]: both 2d
Acro [11k\]: t17 is enormous?
deft [4d\]: T17 is not that big at the moment
ChampFr [-\]: is big but not urgent
ChampFr [-\]: urgent move before big move, it's the rule
Acro [11k\]: <nod>
]
;B[op]CR[op]
;W[np]CR[np]C[Acro [11k\]: so white's hurrying to live down here, I guess
deft [4d\]: not quite alive...
ChampFr [-\]: n2 funny
deft [4d\]: M2
sita [2d\]: but then, this whole group was dead all the time?
ChampFr [-\]: dead
sita [2d\]: b didn't play there two times in a row...
domi [1k?\]: M2 is better isn'it ?
bass [3k\]: sita, q4 was ko threat white ignored
ChampFr [-\]: yes
]
;B[km]CR[km]C[deft [4d\]: L7 lets W off the hook in my opinion
sita [2d\]: no, q4 was answered by o2, some moves later
sita [2d\]: no other b move in this area in between.
domi [1k?\]: so W is alive now ???
ChampFr [-\]: b is winning
noir [1k\]: is white alive?
deft [4d\]: has to play M2
ChampFr [-\]: L7 is a declaration of win
deft [4d\]: I know, but he's not ahead so it's a bad move
]
;W[mk]CR[mk]
;B[mj]CR[mj]
;W[mm]CR[mm]
;B[kj]CR[kj]C[domi [1k?\]: did you count precisely deft ?
sita [2d\]: well...
ChampFr [-\]: *farid ( b) is very strong in endgamle
deft [4d\]: what is W doing???
]
;W[ii]CR[ii]
;B[ih]CR[ih]C[ChampFr [-\]:  i lost againts him by 3.5
ChampFr [-\]:  fanfan by 0.5
]
;W[pe]CR[pe]
;B[oe]CR[oe]
;W[kn]CR[kn]C[ChampFr [-\]:  while we had a won game
]
;B[jn]CR[jn]C[Acro [11k\]: this is very odd
Acro [11k\]: do both sides think W can live on the spot?
bass [3k\]: w short on time, i think
deft [4d\]: B had many chances to kill...
sita [2d\]: indeed
Acro [11k\]: I'd love to see how
domi [1k?\]: when this M2 ?
deft [4d\]: maybe B loves to play endgame...
bass [3k\]: m2 kills w dead
deft [4d\]: I prefer to win by K.O.
]
;W[lr]CR[lr]C[deft [4d\]: like Sakata :-)
]
;B[or]CR[or]C[Acro [11k\]: n2?
Haboru [5d\]: dead
ChampFr [-\]: also dead
domi [1k?\]: hmmmm right
]
;W[mp]CR[mp]C[ChampFr [-\]: o3
sita [2d\]: very interesting....
Acro [11k\]: o3 then n1 kills
sita [2d\]: o2 now?
]
;B[ms]CR[ms]C[sita [2d\]: or n1 kills also.
ChampFr [-\]: all moves kill
Acro [11k\]: n1 connects to either side
Acro [11k\]: doesn't it?
ChampFr2 [-\]: white resigned
bass [3k\]: no need to connect
sita [2d\]: yes, but after w n2, b hast to play o3
ChampFr [-\]: Tombarello (2d) won against warkentin eric
ChampFr2 [-\]: thank you all for watching this game
domi [1k?\]: so we have to study tsumego
deft [4d\]: yes :-)
ChampFr2 [-\]: see you all in 1/2h for the 6xth round
ChampFr [-\]:  and emmanuel patrick won against hirjoghe edouard
ChampFr [-\]: w resigned
domi [1k?\]: and Monique ..???
ChampFr [-\]: lost
domi [1k?\]: thanks all and bye :)
Codexus [18k\]: thanks for all the comments...
])
